Trad climbing sling vs runner reddit On longish trad routes or multipitch I usually do both and split it pretty even between over-the-shoulder nylon slings with a wiregate each and the rest as dyneema alpine draws. Climbing in Yosemite, for example, will often give you two bolts in close proximity if you have bolted anchors at all. They tend to be more versatile and durable than dyneema slings, and they are cheap enough to cut up or leave behind. You can share carabiners between your quickdraws and alpine draws and just swap them out depending on if you're trad climbing and sport climbing. Plus, then you would need to buy two sets of slings (dog bones + slings) if you were serious about trad climbing. The melting temperature doesn't really matter either - I don't think there's been a single documented case of melted slings in alpine draws during proper use. Even climbing on Little Cottonwood Granite with weird flares and pin scars, one of my Metolius cams or an offset cam/nut fit the same or better than an equivalent Totem. So currently I use a pre built quad with a 120cm sling for sport climbing. 1x 120cm nylon runner, often used for a clove v configuration or girthing a medium tree when I'm not worried about redundancy. every area is different but that one fits a large majority of climbs. Trying a 5. BD: big cams. ) nylon sling will last much longer and hold up to more wear and tear so Aug 18, 2019 · The double-length sling, also known as “shoulder length,” is far and away the most common length, and makes up the majority of the slings on pretty much every traditional climber's rack we know. I hope that helps anyone here or future google search users that land on this page. Over the shoulder I carry around 10x36" slings with one carabiner attached to each sling (This can cause some tangling) I then clip a sling into the racking biner and the biner (preattached) to the sling I clip into the rope. It would also eat up real estate on belt loops, making shoulder slings for gear more necessary. Keeps the front 4 loops clear for cams/nuts and slings while I climb. Summit packs are made to sit up high on your back so that you can get to gear on the back of your harness easily. From what I've read they are all great cams but they all have some small differences: BD Z4s: Rigid flex stem :) Good range for > 0. Pick just the extension you need and no more. My take is that the dragons are really great for alpine climbing. 1x 120cm nylon runner tied into what I call a "baby quad". Stuff like prusiks, gloves, belay plate and a nanotrax+tiblock for rescue. It would eat up the slings and make them less accessible for other pro if all of the nuts aren't needed, but slings don't weigh anything, so rack a few more. I started with 4 which in most cases was enough, I was using extendable only when needed and using my sport draw for when I needed no extension. So we tested it. 240mm dyneema/nylon sling is also great, especially if you're not worried about complicated belay stations. Middle Rear (5th loop): Bought my Petzl Aquila specifically for this loop for trad climbing. How long should the cordelette be, and is there a "best" diameter? I have seen anywhere from 14ft to 30ft for length and that a minimum diameter is around 5. I've never seen a sling bag while out climbing multi p and it strikes me as a poor choice. I have a big background in backpacking and long hikes. (Like 1/2lb). Dogbones aren't long enough to extend from your placements when trad climbing. The benefits of a clean nose carabiner really make a difference on bolts. My trad RP is actually higher than my sport (13a vs 12d). What gear to carry, where to carry it and how to rack it are key considerations as you progress in your skills as a lead trad climber. Though it can be made a number of ways, a sling (also known as a runner) is typically created by sewing a webbing section into a loop. These extendable quickdraws will help manage rope drag on meandering pitches. As the title suggests, as someone who's looking to start building a rack, I'm curious as to whether or not long time trad climbers replace every single sling in their kit every few years due to age. the knot might snag. Me personally, I hang them over the shoulder with 1 biner on each, except for one runner that has a couple extra biners for when I place nuts. Max onsight are both 12b. I use a 240 centimeter sling for trad anchors and it works for many different types of anchors as well as being lighter than the same amount of cord. These slings are the perfect length to extend a piece of protection so that the rope runs easier with less rope drag. I’m looking into getting into more alpine climbing so I was wondering what’s best for me moving on. The sling works as well as a piece of 6mm cord but is also a full strength (22KN) sling which I carry as an alpine quickdraw. Most alpine climbing you'd be doing shouldn't take more than a set of cams and a set of nuts unless you're doing big alpine rock routes like those in the Sierras. I prefer rope for swapping leads, and just use slings other times so I don't have to carry a cordelette. 5mm. Personally, I have a 7mm, 6mm, and 240mm sling in my closet since I like variety and they're inexpensive as far as trad climbing gear goes. Mar 13, 2024 · If you’re short on biners, try girth-hitching a cam’s sling (fig. We would like to show you a description here but the site won’t allow us. IMO fancy carabiners dont really matter much for trad climbing and especially sling draws. WC: Off-fingers to fist size. The discussion over nylon vs. 30 meters seems like a lot of material for an anchor considering most ropes for climbing are 60-70m. Left Rear: alpine draws and maybe a double length runner for super extended placements. These uses tend to not be very rough on slings. Typically still over 10kn. I have a double rack of cams, one set friends, one set C4s. I don't know why people are feeding you a bunch of ridiculous information in this thread. Basically, once the ends are clipped together it’s identical to a normal sling. I've been fortunate enough to know the couple of trad routes that I've done that I can use sports for the first 1/2 pitch, then I'll need some super long one, then medium sized (blue) slings. I'm curious how people approach this, in the effort to keep the zigzag down. It’s actually sort of the opposite. I do 10 of these, and then some longer slings on my harness. For sport routes, nice and easy, sport draws. Experience: climbing and mountaineering for 3 years, took a trad climbing course 2 years ago. 1 short, 13 medium, 4 long. Disadvantages: more potential for a tangly mess. This allows me to have a sling I can use as a prusik without issue but can also function as a spare sling or an extra quickdraw. Mammut contact sling is my personal favorite. It’s essential in mountaineering, and very quick for the type of personal anchors that create that unique anchor-loading situation. . The 5th loop holds all of my nonsense gear that I carry for non climbing/emergencies. Dyneema. On here sits all the extra stuff. If I buy a 20ft length at 7mm would that be enough? I am not doing much trad climbing, mostly sport, and the quad will be used to set up top rope anchors. How many cams and alpine qd depends on how hard the climb would be, but general scrambling with some small pitch climbing around 4 cams and 6 qd, but I' Know all 3, and pick one you are most comfortable with. And yes, you can tie knots in it in and no it won't break (for any normal anchor building application). In normal multipitch id much rather have trad draws with 2 biners than single biner. it depends on where you're climbing. When I started trad climbing I simply bought 60cm dyneema sling and converted my sport quickdraw into extendable. Photos in some of my old climbing books show Brit climbers using tied cordage for extenders. The slings for alpines are fairly cheap on their own. I climb in the Gunks where there is a fair mix of tree anchors, bolted anchors, and gear anchors. I would get 6x sling draws, cheapest and lightest you can find, 6x wiregate quickdraws, lightest and cheapest you can find, and 6x sport quickdraws with beefy dogbones and solid Get a handful of alpine draws for trad climbing to supplement your quickdraws, get more when you start climbing mountains. Basically it’s a regular sling/runner, sewn shut in the middle. But they all have advantages and disadvantages. I also have 3 120cm cord slings for emergency Prusiks, for bailing, or if I run out of slings. Adjama Is my go to as well. 240 cm is the biggest standard sewn sling size and is the perfect amount of material for a quad. I've been trawling the internet for reviews and tests and most I could find were on OutdoorGearLab and UK Climbing Forums from some years ago. 5, but don’t do this with a wired nut; the cinching action of the girth-hitch can cut the sling in a fall). Use the 14-20L summit packs that several companies (Outdoor Research, BD, Petzl etc) sell. Totems: smallest 4 sizes. I carry 21' of 7mm cord because i feel it can handle all of these applications and gives me the best options for extending belays, finding comfortable stances, etc. Jul 5, 2020 · Maybe no long slings. If 1/2lb makes it breaks your climb and you're not climbing 5. For situations that will put a lot of abuse on gear, like top rope anchors or multi-pitch anchors, I like cordelette or tied nylon runners. e. Every climber should learn the one-handed clove hitch. If it was small diameter (1/4" Goldline) it was usually doubled. In this article, we'll discuss some best practices for assembling your "rack" — all your nuts, cams, carabiners, 'draws, etc. Nylon runners are multi-purposed and can be used for both sport and trad climbing. With all the slings on alpine quickdraws and cams (I believe I was seeing Dmm cams had slings permanently stitched together around the cam stems Posted by u/hnbike - 2 votes and 10 comments Apr 5, 2023 · You can use your sport climbing quickdraws, but most trad climbers will have a separate trad rack of draws made up of single-length and double-length slings with two carabiners. Trad climbing often involves crack climbing , which is a different style of climbing from face climbing. The totems add confidence in small cracks and pockets. 3, this works for wires, too) you’ll shorten the extension. Personally, I think the whole static vs. I tend to prefer the friends for the reasons you've mentioned. offsets nuts are really nice to have I used to use all trad draws when I climbed at the Gunks. In my opinion the extendable sling doesn't often offer enough extension to avoid using/carrying draws and n most cases, but will create an added margin of safety by allowing you to extend to avoid a feature that might cause the draw to unclip or lever over an edge. My background in placing gear is 30% alpine, 65% mixed sport climbing (you have bolts and pegs but using gear is advisable) and 5% pure trad. Extendable slings are great in this setting. You can either cut up your cordelette, cut up one of your nice expensive Dyneema slings or take my sage advice about carrying at least one tied runner. — on a gear sling or harness gear loops (or a combo) so you'll be able to quickly reach what you need during your climb. Futzing with over the shoulder slings sucks more then carrying an extra 10 carabiners. You can also loop them into alpine draws if you prefer. 6 or so alpine draws a few of your sport quickdraws, some 7mm cord to build anchors and some lockers. C4s are great for pure trad: when I’m pumped while placing gear I really enjoy a thumb loop. Its stronger to connect 2 slings with a carabiner or use a long sling, but it doesn't strike me as that silly of a thing to do as long as you know the outcome. Yeah, this is probably the best way. Bowline can be done with either an open loop (bowline on a bight) or a standing end. No pure trad pitches outside the course (little beginner-suitable rock for that around here) but maybe a few dozen pitches of mixed trad (runout pitons and bolted/natural features belays mostly) and passages of alpine I protected on gear. there's a lot of information in the stickied post on this sub but standard rack is doubles . Sometimes I add 2 extra draws or 2 double length slings depending on the route. Of course, you wouldn't knot Dyneema webbing. If I need to I bring my trad quickdraws or alpine draws (really long or wandering After a couple years trad climbing, here's what I would do if I had the money to build a new rack from scratch. In terms of rope efficiency, it can be done with fairly short slings. Aug 18, 2019 · The double-length sling, also known as “shoulder length,” is far and away the most common length, and makes up the majority of the slings on pretty much every traditional climber's rack we know. I am a fan of Sterling power cord after only one climb. Specifically, buying oz runner kits and splitting the silver biners that come with them into two draws using a spare runner and two orange hoodwires. dynamic is a moot point considering you should never take a direct fall on either spectra or nylon slings. Now, I climb in the west and prefer 6 long draws and 6 over the shoulder slings with a single biner each. dyneema slings is a long one and worth reading up on. And I didn't know a lot. By doubling the runner through the cam’s sling (fig. half the strength and weight of a normal sling. They are also light for alpine stuff. If I had to use double length slings, I would almost certainly use a cordelette. Apr 25, 2012 · On slabs, the gear swings forward and gets in the way; on steeps, the gear sling swings back and feels like it is pulling you off. I've never seen anybody preclip gear to slings, bandolier style or with quick/alpine draws. Grigri, ATC, prusik, triple or quad length sling or a cordalette, bail gear, etc. you can supplement with bigger or smaller gear if you need to. Sling Length 60cm runners are pretty standard for Trad. A sling can be used as an extended quickdraw to allow your rope to run straighter and decrease friction on wandering routes, or it can be used to set up an anchor. 2 long ones if needed to keep the rope straight, 2 long ones for the anchor. set of nuts. Totems are overhyped for free-climbing IMO. The resultant anchor point is non-redundant. Apr 11, 2023 · looks like an even better version of the rabbit runner! Not really. This is probably mostly a climbing myth perpetuated by the article that's quoted in the above link Trad climbing with quickdraws is not ideal, but it works if you bring a few alpines as well for strategic extensions. I like to take a 60cm aramid sling for friction hitches. TL;DR: If you like Oz carabiners the runner sets are a great deal. internally redundant) Learning to use the rope for your anchors was the biggest leap I made in trad climbing. honestly i think you can find shitty personalities in every kind of climbing--sure you've got trad dads who won't climb harder than 5. You will find that using a single sling for pas and for other purposes is not practical as you will spend unnecessary time tying and untying knots rather than climbing! And I second the advice to get a 120cm sling for general purpose (anchor building, alpine draw, etc. 7 but go on about how "sport climbing is neither," but you've also got sport climbers who shit on trad climbers for the precise reasons you've outlined and argue the opposite side of the coin that sport climbing And I absolutely agree on if the bolts are further spaced apart than usual. 10 pitch is stress-free when you understand that it goes at 5. 7 C1 if you get shut down. For most of trad climbing bailing is easier than sport! You just aid through the hard moves. com Jul 2, 2018 · I have been using the clove hitch with a Dyneema sling (Clove Hitch Trad Anchor) to build my anchors, but after watching the DMM Video(DMM Sling test) of them breaking slings, with the knotted Dyneema breaking at way less than the knotted Nylon sling, I am considering changing to the Nylon 240cm sling. It requires more rope than a girth hitch, but can be done with a climbing rope which is a monolithic anchor (i. For an alpine rack I would carry less cams, more nuts, some 60cm alpine qd and two 120cm slings with biners clipped end to end around chest. The WCs are basically C4s with extendable slings, but only go up to fist size. No one-size-fits all in either climbing style (blocks vs swing) or anchor building (slings vs rope). The only issue I can see with making your own is if you make a normal length sling, and double it so it's shorter as a quick-draw, there might be some hanky panky if you're trying to extend it to the regular length by unclipping the biner, clipping 1 strand and then pulling. See full list on outdoorgearlab. 3 :) No extendable sling :( WC Zero Friends: The image of a sling straight vs doubled vs girth hitched and it's relative strengths float around and is taken as doctrine. I almost never climb with a gear sling, for this reason. BD 18mm nylon Dyneema slings, on the other hand, have a higher load capacity at exactly the same weight, and a smaller diameter – which makes them ideal for adventurous sport climbing, multi-pitch climbing, and alpine tours. There are lots of wandering routes there. Sure if you're climbing tips cracks in sandstone then it could be better, but definitely not if you're placing hand size pieces in granite. A thing about trad-climbing is being able to improvise with what you got, in the most efficient and safe manner. I usually only need two single length slings to create the anchor. Since you're asking about trad climbing, at some point in your career you're going to have to untie and thread your sling or use it for rap tat. To give blanket advice to use the most stretchy rope for all trad climbing is just wrong. In short, trad climbing, more formally known as traditional climbing, is a form of rock climbing that requires placing your own gear for protection, rather than solely relying on pre-placed bolts. Works just fine - but now, it's nicer to have a full rack of DMM Alpha sport QD's :) Dogbones can be purchased individually so really there's no real savings in using slings - more hassle, if anything! The only time I use them now is for trad climbing, where a long sling can be doubled over using a clove hitch to extend a piece if needed. Before Climbing Anchors was released I had picked up used copies of older two part series (1990's climbing anchors + more climbing anchors), as I was getting more serious about climbing and trying to get a better handle on knowing what I didn't know. I owned a set black-green and sold them because I preferred my ULMCs. Aug 31, 2020 · Black Diamond Nylon Runner; Petzl ANNEAU Polyester Sling; How to Choose the Best Climbing Slings for Your Needs Nylon vs. That being said, if you’ve got rope to spare for anchor building you certainly gain a lot of ease in connecting pieces (don’t have to fiddle with making static arms and other weird configurations). 1x 240cm nylon runner that is rarely used, only for the biggest trees (and often as a basket hitch) or when the three pieces are in wildly different spots. 11+ trad, then youre probably better off losing 1/2lb body weight or getting more skill/experience. I still carry at least one tied double length runner because it's easy to untie and thread/use for rap tat. 5-3 C4 cam size. A rabbit runner is a normal sling, cut open. Now I have 8 extendable. How are slings constructed? Slings can be constructed in two ways: They can either be sewn or seamless. In short, nylon is heavier and stretchier, while dyneema slings are lighter, less absorbent, and more slippery. For sport I have 18 Spirit keylock QDs. Cheers. The one HUGE exception to my gear sling hatred is for some squeezes and OWs, where it is advantages to have the gear on a sling on the outside-side of your body. Climbing Slings. I say start with 4 and add some if you need it.
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